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Reply with quote  #1 



What books would you recommend for someone wanting to ID finds from the London Clay Basement Bed...?
 

Cheers

 

Geth
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Fred

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Reply with quote  #2 
Are these finds from Bishopstone glen?

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Reply with quote  #3 



Hi Fred! Big smile
 

Nope... They're all from Ramsholt (where some kind Censored has recently hacked up the cliffs, yet been too stupid to collect the Basement Bed bounty that was just lying around on the beach).

 

Come to think of it, Fred, you've got a London Clay book, no? Do you have much shark and ray stuff from the Basement Bed in it...?
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AMARSH

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Reply with quote  #4 
Hi Gethin
 

Any chance of some photos? Is Ramsholt any good at the moment?

 

Cheers

Andrew

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Reply with quote  #5 

Hi Andrew! Big smile


Ramsholt was OK, though we only stopped there for a quick visit... And some Censored Censored ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. CTRL+F5 reloads the whole page. Censored ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. CTRL+F5 reloads the whole page. mindless idiot had hacked the buggery out of the (highly sensitive) SSSI nature-reserve cliffs. Found loads of broken fossils where the muppet(s) had been digging... It's enough to make you weep... Such mindless vandalism... Grrr!!

 

Found a few good bits and pieces, though the picking was a bit slim (aside from the Basement Bed).

 

Anyways, the light here is pretty poor, so I'll just post the very few pics I took this afternoon. Derived Ramsholt teeth from yesterday's visit...

 

 

Derived shark teeth from the London Clay Basement Bed:

 

SDC12443.jpg 

 

SDC12449.jpg 

 

SDC12454x.jpg 

 

 

Derived ray teeth from the London Clay Basement Bed:

 

SDC12461z.jpg 

 

 SDC12463.jpg 
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Naze Dave

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Reply with quote  #6 
Nice stuff there Geth, that tooth in the 2nd pic, it might just be coincidental chips but it looks slightly serrated to me?
Thanks
Dave

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Reply with quote  #7 



That's very observant, Dave! The serrations are much more visible on the reverse side...
 

I'm thinking Procarcharodon species - off the top of my head - but I'm not sure if they existed when the London Clay was deposited. Any suggestions...?

 

Cheers! Big smile

 

Gef
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Reply with quote  #8 
I'm not sure, does if feel particularly 'thin'? I've only ever found one serrate tooth which is a very small fragment, i could upload a pic if you want.
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Dave

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Reply with quote  #9 



It sure does, Dave... Not wanting to get too technical here - not least of all because I can't with my limited knowledge of shark teeth - but yes, it's one of those very broad yet thin shark teeth...
 

And yes please! I'd love to see your one if you don't mind uploading a pic. That'd be great!Thumbs Up

 

I'll also take a few better shots of my tooth...
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Reply with quote  #10 
OK, so here's a slightly better shot of the serrations, as well as a cross-sectional pic from where the broken off root would have been.
 

Tooth measures approx 1.8cm tall, and is 1.6cm wide at the base:

 

 SDC12555.jpg 

 

SDC12541.jpg 


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Reply with quote  #11 
Hi Gethin
 

Nice finds. Did you find any crabs? I'm still after one from Ramsholt.

 

Andrew

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Fred

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Reply with quote  #12 
The basement bed is on the cusp of the palaeocene and the Eocene. Most of the species will be represented in our book, but some of the crossover species maight not be. I cant be sure of this. Quite a few of the London clay sharks have been re- assessed and given different names from the ones represented in our first book. The new book is as up to date as we can make it. However the specimens that you are finding are very polished and worn down. It will be difficult to ID most of the teeth as the differences between similar species has been worn away. The book does illustrate specimens from all the major collecting sites in Kent and Essex and also describes how to collect as the sections are eroding in very different ways.
Fred


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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMARSH
Hi Gethin
 

Nice finds. Did you find any crabs? I'm still after one from Ramsholt.

 

Andrew







Alas no, my friend... I've not a single crab from Ramsholt as yet, but tbh I only just started collecting from the Basement Bed. Before now it's all been very Coralline Crag coral+bryozoan-orientated collecting...
 

Perhaps a little wager might be in order here? And whoever of us finds the first Ramsholt crab owes the other one a pint in the Ramsholt Arms...? Wink ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. CTRL+F5 reloads the whole page.
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Reply with quote  #14 



Fred...
 

The latest edition sounds very good to me. And I sincerely take my hat off to you for not simply shamelessly plugging your book at this easy opportunity. You're a good egg, methinks. Thumbs Up

 

It's a bit of a punt, but I've got a fair few spare book-tokens... Is there any chance I can buy a copy with those...?

 

Cheers

 

Geth

 

 
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ThomasM

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Reply with quote  #15 
I've got a copy of Fred's book and it really is excellent, definately get it.

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Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasM
I've got a copy of Fred's book and it really is excellent, definately get it.





Thanks for the recommendation, Thomas. I'll definitely get it. Just a case of sooner rather than a bit later if I can use these damn book tokens that are burning a hole in my almost-book-collection... Wink ... Shift+R improves the quality of this image. CTRL+F5 reloads the whole page.
 

ps. Fred... when I buy a copy I can add a bit of a write-up on my itty-bitty fossil forum, if you like?
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Reply with quote  #17 

Why can't I edit the above post immediately ater posting...?


Any ideas, kind admin folks...?


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Naze Dave

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Reply with quote  #18 
Which bed do those polished Cosmopolitodus teeth and Megalodons come out of then? i'm a little confused lol.
Thanks
Dave

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Reply with quote  #19 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naze Dave
Which bed do those polished Cosmopolitodus teeth and Megalodons come out of then? i'm a little confused lol.
Thanks

Dave






Unless I've mis-diagnosed, Dave, then they're all from the London Clay Basement Bed. And I'd assume the Bed-diagnosis is correct, as they are, as you say, polished rather than worn, so what with being from Ramsholt straight-up London Clay, Coralline Crag, and red Crag don't quite fit...
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Fred

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Reply with quote  #20 
If you follow the link to my websites, you will see the link to the advertisment for the book. Unfortunately bok tokens are not acceptable because this is a private limited print run that we financed ourselves. The book are sold privately only. The shark teeth illustrated on my Sheppey website still have the older ID'd but may give you some help. Your serrated tooth is very interesting, but not derived from the London Clay. It comes from much younger beds. The otodus lineage is quite complex but only began to show the first signs of serration in its very youngest divisions, for instance Division E and into the middle Eocene beds. Look at the Barton teeth for a comparison or look at the otodus lineage on elasmo.com
I hope that this helps.
Fred


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Reply with quote  #21 



Thanks very much for the info and advice, Fred! Much appreciated... Big smile

This throws up the rather interesting possibility that it could be from the Red Crag. I'll look into it further, but I really hope it is.
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Naze Dave

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Reply with quote  #22 
Hi Geth, one or two pics you may (or may not) find interesting lol.
First of all, this is my tiny (~10mm) shark tooth fragment with evidence of serrations. Interestingly they appear to be much more regular than those on your tooth.
CIMG6847.JPG 

CIMG6846.JPG 

Also, here is a tooth from either Belgium, it is Cosmopolitodus escheri.
CIMG6836.JPG 

Thanks
Dave



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Reply with quote  #23 



Very nice Dave! [and interesting too! Wink]
 

My tooth has got equally regular serrations, though they're more widely spaced... It's just difficult to get a good pic of them with my lacklustre camera skills...lol
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Reply with quote  #24 
Rob, what has an electric guitar got to do with the London clay, teeth, Crag?
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Reply with quote  #25 
I was wondering the same. Original post is 7yrs old. I think the experienced people who posted know the difference.
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Rob

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Reply with quote  #26 
sorry rong  pic
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Rob

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Reply with quote  #27 
Hi and welcome to the forum the black shiny ones come from the crag and the grey ones come from the London clay
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Reply with quote  #28 
8yr old post Rob
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