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AndyS

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Reply with quote  #51 
I'd love a copy if you can spare it...

AndyS

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fossils-uk

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Reply with quote  #52 
Interesting to see the said fossils. I hope with any
Amateurs publishing papers that they get their prospective papers peer reviewed before publication. There have been several times in recent years where this has not happened and there has been glaring mistakes within the body of work. I name the French book on dactylioceras family as one such tome.
If it is about bite marks in dacs I will presume that you know that 80% of dacs with parts missing is due to diagenetic reasons or out gasing. The jury is still out on whether the proms from Lyme are predation. I personally doubt it and prefer an diagenetic reason for the damage.
Will be interesting to debate the paper once published :-)
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Reply with quote  #53 
Hi

I'd be interested in a copy or a link to a PDF please.

Good luck with the publication as it's always good to see papers by us amateurs.

All the best

Nick

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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #54 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fossils-uk
Interesting to see the said fossils. I hope with any
Amateurs publishing papers that they get their prospective papers peer reviewed before publication. There have been several times in recent years where this has not happened and there has been glaring mistakes within the body of work. I name the French book on dactylioceras family as one such tome.
If it is about bite marks in dacs I will presume that you know that 80% of dacs with parts missing is due to diagenetic reasons or out gasing. The jury is still out on whether the proms from Lyme are predation. I personally doubt it and prefer an diagenetic reason for the damage.
Will be interesting to debate the paper once published :-)
Byron


It is peer reviewed. As for seeing them, I will post pics another day, but I'm donating the actual specimens to the Yorkshire Museum. The French book on Dactylioceras? Can't say I'm familiar with that one. 
I recall you've mentioned outgassing or diagenetic causes for damage in another thread. Are there any papers supporting that? 
As I'm sure you'll understand, I've read widely before writing. I don't want to think how many papers I've read, not of all which figured in the final paper. Damage by semionotid fishes, mosasaurs, lobsters, implosion, damage to modern Nautilus shells by collision, rolling, etc, etc. You might be interested to know there's a paper just published on damaged ammonites from Tenant's Cliff (http://pygs.lyellcollection.org/content/early/2014/04/22/pygs2014-336.abstract). 

As you say, it will be interesting to debate. 

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wiccaman9

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Reply with quote  #55 

Congratulations Deltapodus,
 
   Publishing is good, I have a paper published in the Mercian Geologist and a forthcoming paper will be published this year also. They recall my dramatic discoveries of new locations and new fossil forms, with new species to Britain, and potentially completely new species, Worldwide.
 
   They relate to Ediacaran fossils, late Precambrian, of Leicestershire. I have discovered 21 new fossil planes to add to the 6 known fossil planes, within the last 2 years.
 
 My latest discovery is a fossil plane with a rough tally of 400 fossil specimens, making it the most fossil dense location in Britain for Ediacaran fossils...
 
 Some hyperlinks at the end...
 
 We amateur geologists/palaeontologists have a LOT to offer. There is no reason why, if we discover something significant, that we should not publish in scientific journals, assuming 'peer review' is fine.
 
 Cheers,
 
 Aron
https://independent.academia.edu/AronBowers
http://www.charniaresearchgroup.com/references.html
 
 
 

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moneypenny

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Reply with quote  #56 
speaking as someone who used to be employed in South Kensington as a museum curator, sadly, i have to tell you that unless you have something incredibly rare or unusual, your item will go to live in one of the museums dusty store houses scattered around London. I was horrified when i saw how much stuff never gets shown to the public.....and sad, as many people labour under a misconception that they are helping museums by gifting items to them. You are better off with small local museums if your item is pertinent to them - at least there is some chance your item will be shown and cared for, rather than stored away in a box..... On the subject of papers, there are SO many submitted every month, and only the best, and most important and readable are published.....why not "publish" a paper as a podcast, or an illustrated paper/lecture on Youtube? - these media as easier to access then journals, and will be listened to by many people, without the constraints of having to obtain the journal.....if what you have to say is important enough, you may be invited to write a aper by a respected journal....its worth a try 
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fossils-uk

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Reply with quote  #57 
Thanks for that link.. Looks a very interesting paper to read indeed. :-)
Byron

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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #58 
Erm, when I click on the link, all  I get is page not found.

As for publishing papers, the YGS is encouraging members to publish more. Follow the link for more, and scroll down - the relevant info is almost at the end, under the heading Important notice  to members and others: short communications.


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Asterixx

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Reply with quote  #59 
Hi,

in Aronƒâ€š‚´s post the three URLs read as one. In your browser, you need to edit the address line into 3 separate addresses.

the paper is here:

https://www.academia.edu/4503420/Precambrian_fossil_discoveries_and_new_fossil_localities_in_Charnwood_Forest_Leicestershire


BTW Aron GREAT STUFF !! .... thanks for posting

Brian
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #60 
Hi I'm to this website, but up on seeing this thread I felt the need to share my recent experiences.
In all honesty I some what stumbled in to fossil hunting January this year when I started visiting a Mesolithic site close to where I live and walking up and down the site not only was I finding pottery but also 'strange' stones. Then I ran in to a collector on the beach one day he introduced him self and explained he was as a uni professor and that this site dated back to the Eocene, and explained to me what to look for.

That was it I was addicted, and found myself heading up the site as soon as the children where at school, I was getting about 4 hours a day out there and my nights cleaning and attempting to Identify them.

Then just as I was being to wonder what to do with these fossils, Whilest taking my children to our town museum, I noticed that their "history of our area" only ran from Mesolithic to modern so I approach them about would they like some pieces so they could show this part of the towns history. The people I spoke to seamed very keen, so down I went with a small selection, Everyone at the museum seamed thrilled and I must admit I met a retired geology profession who has been extremely helpful answering my questions and explaining thing that confused me. As I handed over my finds I asked would they be displayed (because in my opinion if they are just going to be sat in a cupboard gathering dust I might as well keep them) Oh no they say, they will definitely be on display. So the weeks pass and each week I wander down with my finds (Which they will only take if I identify them?!)
and then Monday as I handed over this week donation I inquired about when my finds would make their way to display? Erm well November maybe or next April, some time next year was their reply. 

I must say after all the time and effort finding, cleaning and identifying them I feel some what irked that they are now just gathering dust, and I doubt I will be making any further donations.
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Olenus

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Reply with quote  #61 
Hello Jennie, out of interest what were your finds. It's a shame things like this happen.

Lee

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acutipuerilis

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Reply with quote  #62 


Hi Jennie,

    This is an issue that frequently frustrates donors, but that is often because it's hard for people outside museums to appreciate the glacial pace that things often move at. Museums are now (in general) very understaffed and under-funded, and an enormous amount of paperwork goes on that you don't see. Maintaining a collection is a major work, and the displays are the fun bits that the curators would love to do more of, if only they had time.

   In this case, it sounds like it involves creating a whole new display. Before that can happen, all the specimens need to be properly databased, and the existing displays need to be modified to accommodate the new material, or cases shifted around. Research needs to be done in order to put together informative captions (the curators will know less about the fossils than you do, in most cases - hardly anywhere outside the national museums have specialist geological curators nowadays). The captions sometimes then have to go through other departments for readability etc., and be formatted correctly, and this alone can add weeks to the process in some museums. New cases may have to be bought, and that involves applying for grants first (which may or may not be awarded). What I'm trying to get across is that having an entirely new display put together by next year is actually very good going.

I've got a suggestion, which you may well decide to ignore... but anyway. Offer to help in putting the exhibition together, in cataloguing the finds and writing the captions.  If you can give them some time as a volunteer, you'll help to push the process along, as well as getting the satisfaction of being really involved in the process and the finished product. Also, once you get to know the staff and the struggles they have to keep the place running, you might be more appreciative of the timescales involved in getting the displays right.

It's a wonderful hobby, and you can really make an impression in the field simply by finding things and making them available for other people to see. Good luck!

Joe

p.s. I've been a museum curator and an academic researcher, and am now largely an amateur (working a lot with our local, very small museum), so I've seen all sides of it over the years...


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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #63 
Hi Lee 

My finds where fossilized bi-valves, flint nodules with fossilized shells in side, Belemites,flint_with_shell_yellow.jpg flint_with_shell_pink.jpg belemite.jpg 
sharks vertebra, fish vertebra, shark teeth, fish teeth (two different types), ray teeth and coprolites, fossilized crabs (which took me hours to clean up, as I do it with just a toothbrush and nail file), latest_crab.jpg box_of_crabs_and_lobsters.jpg 
Pyritized gastropods (several types), pyritized wood and plant branches and roots and seeds, al accompanied with a map I had drawn marking out all my finds and showing the locations on the beach I found them. (and a few Mesolithic animal bones and teeth for good measure as their current Mesolithic display has none just tools). I wish I had photos of all of it, it is such a waste they told me they would love enough for a whole display on the Eocene, so once I felt that I had submitted enough to fill a display cabinet (presuming it would be the same size as they currently use)
I asked when it would be going in, and that is when she started fudging about "err umm November or April probably next year" 

I had been feeling guilty for keeping my favorite find the only byrozone on sandstone fossil I have found.


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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #64 
Hi Joe,

Thank you for the advice, I have offered to help when I handed them and I was surprised when told they could not accept unidentified finds as I had expected them to disregard what I thought they where as I could be just guessing for all they know. All though volunteering at the museum is a very helpful retired geologist who check all there fossils.

It is interesting you mention a lot of paper work goes into it because when I first approached the about donating them they said I would have to fill in lots of form so I was surprised when I went down and out came one sheet of A4 which other than my name and address and signature the lady wrote "my surname the site name fossils, and each week when I take more down i would say do you need me to fill anything out they would just say no its fine and they just get the page back out and write + part 2 ect.

I have not pushed to help them too much with regards to the displays because I can get far to domineering at times, but each week I do ask if they would like a hand.

And I always welcome any advice, Thank You

Jennie

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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #65 
Hi all, can I start by saying a big thank you to Joe et al for your words of encouragement, in the many months since my last post I have been very busy as a volunteering at my local museum in Burnham on crouch Essex putting together a display on 'Fossils from Dengie during the Eocene'. I now appreciate how much work goes into a display, it will run from April 1st when the museum opens through till the end of October .

I have just finished laying out the main display table and hope to finish the two uprights and display board this week. (I would post a photo but I can not remember how)

Jennie
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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #66 
Brilliant news Jennie, and great you've got involved as this is the sort of help museums need. We can make things happen! Post photos!
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acutipuerilis

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Reply with quote  #67 


Well done Jennie - I'm really please it's all worked out! :)

Yes, please do post pictures - we'd all love to see it!

Joe


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flintband

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Reply with quote  #68 
A note of caution for Paleo Stu...........................   before you elect Gideon Mantell to sainthood perhaps you might explain the effects of his ocd on both his family and himself !!!!!   Not perhaps the best example of an amateur fossil collector achieving great things.  Perhaps Mary Anning may have been a better choice, although things did not end so well for her either.  There must be a perfect example somewhere, what about Rowe ???
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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #69 
I'll stick with Dr. Mantell. He persevered despite so many obstacles being placed in his path including his social status and background, his health and being ridiculed and snubbed by others.
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #70 
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10206287880734732&set=a.10206231395882646.1073741831.1197516351&type=1

this link should take you to a photo of my main cabinet I finished yesterday, I finished the second of my three cabinets today and will try to upload them tonight.

How do you up load photos to here please?

Jennie
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #71 
main_display_table.jpg the main display table
Cabinet_number_2.jpg the second cabinet
How_I_have_laidout_the_teeth.jpg 
How I have displayed the teeth

Jennie
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DorsetJack

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Reply with quote  #72 
That looks fantastic Jennie - you must be very pleased to see them on display :)
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Doggerfan

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Reply with quote  #73 
Well done! That must be exciting for you!

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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #74 
That is really cool, a smashing set of displays. Congratualtions!
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #75 
Hi 

Yes thank you I am totally thrilled, I  took Joe's adviced and offered to volunteer and the first few weeks I was just helping with dusting and sweeping ect, but then the curator asked me if I wanted set up the display myself,
I know realize how much work does go into a display, but now all the fossils are cleaned and laid out, I got the author of a local fossil guide book to come down the museum and check my i.d's (and tell me which heterodontus was which,lol.) He was kind enough to allow me to use his art work. Three of the local papers and the local radio are promoting it and I have arranged a 'funday' for local kids learning how fossils form using playdough, I still have two display boards to fill one is going to be about the site and finding cleaning them ect, and the other a more general eocene overview (and this is the one I am struggeling a bit with if I am honest) but I still have a week and a half to complete it so I am not to worried.
IMG00159.jpg last cabinet finished to day.

Jennie
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #76 
yey I made my local paper
006.jpg 
Jennie
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Doggerfan

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Reply with quote  #77 
You earned it! Watch out for autograph hunters

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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #78 
thank you and lmao
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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #79 
That's brilliant Jennie and well deserved. Just goes to prove what can happen if we all work together 
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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #80 
You done good there, and deserve that moment in the spotlight. As a teacher, I'm glad to see that bit about getting the kids involved. 


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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #81 
Thank you,  

The museum has agreed to let me put on a Children's fun morning (8th of April 10:30 if anybodies local to me.lol) because my kids find it really interesting so I thought it might be nice to introduce local kids to fossil collecting, so we will be having lots of hunting for shark teeth in sand trays and lots of other activities, the curator is a retired teacher so she is helping me organize it.
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Reply with quote  #82 
Well done Jennie. That's fantastic.

It'd be good to see more people doing that sort of thing. There's lots of good stuff out there.

Best regards

Nick

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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #83 
Wow, all this and inspiring new fossil hunters!

Ace.

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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #84 
It's taken two years from when I  found the fossils to final publication, but it's finally happened. That paper on ammonites has been published online, and the print edition will be in May. 


There's the link - mine is the one on ammonites from the upper Lias of Saltwick Bay. There are times when I've found it hard, dinosaurs are my main interest -  and there's been a steep learning curve on ammonites. It's also a very different style of writing to how you normally write. 
All in all, it's been a  positive experience, and the editors of the YGS were helpful, both in the editing process, and in providing the summary/abstract at the beginning. In case you're wondering, amateurs don't need to provide an abstract. 
   Anyway, there it is. Maybe I'll have to start work on a 2nd one?

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Bill G

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Reply with quote  #85 
Congratulations Thumbs Up
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jennie0212

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Reply with quote  #86 
well done hun
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PaleoStu

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Reply with quote  #87 
Excellent stuff Deltapodus! I look forward to reading it!

My paper on Isle of Wight track and tracksites (published in December) is here:


It is paywalled but if you want a copy PM me with your email address. Two other papers I was co-author on are also available, just check the contents page:

 http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bij.2014.113.issue-3/issuetoc

There's lots there for folk interested in the Early Cretaceous and the Wealden and Jehol.

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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #88 
Thank you.
Can I just point out that the YGS is encouraging amateurs to publish, and will accept short papers (about 2 pages). It was their prompting that encouraged me to have a go, and there must be more than me with finds worth reporting. 

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Reply with quote  #89 
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltapodus
Thank you.
Can I just point out that the YGS is encouraging amateurs to publish, and will accept short papers (about 2 pages). It was their prompting that encouraged me to have a go, and there must be more than me with finds worth reporting. 


Hi Deltapodus

Can you get hold of the paper without paying or do you have to be a member of the YGS?

Thanks

Nick

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deltapodus

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Reply with quote  #90 
Apologies for reviving an old thread... Thought you might be interested to know this - I've got another specimen on its way to the Yorkshire Museum (tomorrow, in fact) - an ammonite with its aptychus in-situ. My experience of donating to them has been a pleasant experience both times. I recently visited the Museum and not only found my previous donation on display, but someone has made a model of what happened to them. [cool] PICT2691.jpg  PICT2702.jpg 

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